Wikileaks

Peter

You know what I think is nuts? I’m STILL seeing shit about how wikileaks is a right wing nationalist Russian organization. Where was the backlash when they published all of Palin’s emails before the 08 election?

Valentine

Where are you seeing all of this backlash? I feel like you’re searching it out and then being upset when you find it

Did you see the russia report

Peter

Which? They published like 4, none with any real evidence that Russia leaked the docs

They keep citing “Russian code”, which is a bit like saying “someone used a Lockheed Martin gun”

Anyway assange is in the news cause of the recent interviews with hannity

Which is why I’m seeing responses to that

Valentine

The one about “influence campaigns”

Peter

Is that the latest by not-all-the-intelligence-communities?

I haven’t read that one yet

Valentine

Also: Hannity lol

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/3254237/Russia-Hack-Report.pdf

Peter

I mean whatever, it’s an interview

Valentine

What I’m saying is I don’t think the media in general is terribly upset with Assange any more

Or at least aren’t primarily pursuing him

Peter

Maybe it’s just useful idiots then.

Lemme take a look at the doc

Also are you in the same timezone?

Valentine

No

Why would London and India be in the same time zone

Wait have you thought I was in Joburg the whole time

Even in that case it wouldn’t be exactly the same but close enough

Peter

O you’re in India

OK

Thought you were in SA

And yea I’m skimming this report and it’s a bit light on details

Valentine

It’s sort of a double bind for intelligence agencies tbh

Since even if they have damning evidence they also probably have pretty good reasons not to publicly reveal their methodologies

Peter

I mean, the method would have to be something so outside the wheelhouse of other experts in security fields

And I understand the concern – it’s kinda like you don’t want to announce that the enigma code was cracked

But STILL there needs to be something, because what’s out there right now is indicating that they’re using a method of attribution that isn’t actually correct

Valentine

Either way I think a reasonable view for the public to take rn would be something like “Russia is up to some naughty shit because of course they are/that’s just what antagonistic governments ~do~, but Hillary still lost on her own accord”

Peter

I don’t like red scares

The last one was so great xD

Valentine

I mean I think it’s a little short-sighted to assume that governments ~don’t~ do shit like this all the time to each other

oh yeah the last red scare was lit 🔥🔥🔥😩👌🏽

E.g. I’d be fairly surprised if America didn’t have its own “influence campaigns” going on in Russia right now

And Putin having a preference for Trump is just demonstrably true

Peter

Speaking of governments doing this all the time, the CIA has a pretty large track record of lying to the public

Valentine

Sure

Peter

Also, what’s the US going to influence? XD rigged elections can’t be influenced much

Valentine

Wasn’t there a big thing about how Comey and a lot of other intelligence officials are pretty pro-Trump though?

Eh, probably trying to drum up anti-Putin activism

Peter

Because they announced they were looking into emails again

Also I believe comey is FBI

Valentine

There was a NYTimes article from an anonymous FBI source talking about how the FBI was “Trump country”

And yes he is

Eh, it’s just a few more days until Trump is inaugurated and America and Russia become great allies

Bonding over mutual indifference to suffering in the Middle East and toxic masculinity and Eastern European women and w/e

Is it reasonable to want Wikileaks to reveal who their source actually is

Obviously there’s all the security risks associated with that given how much America hates whistleblowers now

Peter

I mean frankly wikileaks has a 100% honesty rate

So id be willing to lend them more credibility than the combined US intelligence agencies

Valentine

But rn it’s not a reeeally comforting position for them to just be like “oh I swear it’s not russia guys even though that would make perfect sense”

That also feels silly tbh

Peter

They have a person as a source. The CIA has code.

One of those is more sensitive.

Valentine

Why assume Assange/Wikileaks is somehow more noble/free of agendas than everyone else?

While the man might try to justify their selective coverage they still do have p selective coverage

Peter

Because they seem to publish everything they get their hands on without modification

Also, selective? How?

Valentine

If you standard is “don’t believe anything you can’t know for sure,” then easy rebuttal: how do you know they do?

In terms of which countries they actually bother to blow the whistle on

Peter

They publish on other countries too xD fairly often

Including Russia, I should add

But no one in Russia hears about it because state controlled media

Valentine

This was something Assange himself addressed in his interview and he admitted to the lack of equal coverage pretty straightforwardly

Peter

I believe he said that he doesn’t get as many leaks, not that he selectively published

Which are very very different

If Russian leakers don’t go to wikileaks, that’s different from wikileaks selectively publishing to bias for Russia

Valentine

It’s sort of a strange mix of statements

He says the published some stuff but then is also like “Russia has vibrant political debate” which sounds…wrong

Peter

He’s not talking about political debate, he’s talking about political dissidents

Which there are

Quite a few

Valentine

Perhaps I’m just brainwashed but “state-controlled media w dictatorial president who assassinates political opponents” and “vibrant publications critiquing the government” don’t sound like things that happen at the same time

Or don’t easily happen

Peter

I think he means that there’s a vibrant dissident community

Which I’m not really surprised by because, like, pussy riot exists

Valentine

Sure, and they went to jail

Peter

Yea, but the point is that the community exists

Valentine

So like, I feel like even if dissidents exist it definitely sounds like a political situation where more whistleblowing would be appreciated lol

Peter

Sure, but like… This doesn’t invalidate assange’s point right?

Valentine

It feels like justifying a blind spot to just be like “nah I’m sure those guys have got it”

Peter

Wikileaks doesn’t hack

If they don’t get leaks from Russia, regardless of the reason they aren’t getting leaks for Russia

It’s a bit like criticizing wikileaks for not publishing against the RNC

Valentine

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Peter

They didn’t have the info so what were they supposed to do? Hack the rnc for equivalency?

Valentine

I love how the RNC strategy this election was literally just “submit to the chaos and try to ride the wave”

And it WORKED

Peter

They tried to prevent it tbh

Valentine

They won out of sheer incompetency

Peter

For a really long time xD

Valentine

And luckily they failed

Well, luckily for them

And unluckily for the rest of the human race

Peter

Like even at the convention Cruz gave a speech against Trump

And kasich still doesn’t support Trump

Valentine

And then folded like a week later

Peter

Same with Romney and what’s his name

Current speaker

Ryan

Valentine

I meant the RNC more anyway – Priebus did well for himself

Peter

No not Ryan

Valentine

Once trump won the nomination he jumped on board

Peter

Fuck whats his name

Valentine

Graham?

Peter

No, he was Romney’s vp

Valentine

…that’s Paul Ryan

Peter

O it is Ryan

Valentine

You were right the first time lol

And he is speaker so I was so confused

Peter

OK I was thinking Andrew Ryan which is a character from BioShock

Valentine

lmao

Peter

And I got confused by Rand Paul xD

I was like, “Paul Ryan is that libertarian guy”

Welp

Valentine

something something xkcd plurandy

Peter

Ye

Anyway

I’d like wikileaks to release info on the leaker

Valentine

Just vague info

~something~ to make it seem less like a lie

Peter

I’m a bit more flexible cause it’s a person, not a methodology

Valentine

No yeah that’s what I’m saying

Even vague info would be preferable

Peter

Eh

I think having a policy of no comments on sources is very very good for a whistleblowing organization

Valentine

I mean undeniably true but still annoying in this case

Tbh I kind of want the news cycle to move on from this story

Peter

That would require people to move on from the fact we elected trump xD

Valentine

There are definitely other ways to freak out about electing Scrooge McDuck

Peter

Like I do feel a lot of people are holding onto this as a way to comfort themselves as not-a-legitimate-election

Valentine

I mean yes, that’s been the predominant narrative

I also wish that would die

Since it distracts the left from what the focus really should be, which is restructuring the dems

That said it’s increasingly clear that “what the left wants/what their constituents need” and “what the Democratic Party wants to do” are completely non-overlapping sets

Peter

True

#politics

 

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